CHAPTER THREE  -  Rumi. 


WEEK ONE. conversation by clair and emmanual

1

"there is a community of spirit
join it and feel the delight
of walking in a noisy street 
and being the noise".
Rumi
 

~ ~ ~

The place where we are all one

where we are in communion

is right here right now

whether in nature

in the temple

or on the high street

Spirit embraces all

unconditionally

and we are all that

One Spirit

Hare Krsna

emmanual

does that stop us feeling lonely?

clair

Yes
Loneliness is forgetting
And that is ok too.
X

lonliness is forgetting?  in what way is lonelyness forgetting?
c

Why do you ask me questions you know the answer to?
Forgetting there is no separate self, become the noise, embrace it all, delight in the freedom from the idea of your little self that says no to this yes to that, noise is music too, noise is music that is more than your idea of music, the spirit is more than your idea of spirit, remmember that, don't judge life and search for God, you are life and life is God, delight in that. X

i see, that type of forgetting.  it seems that forgetting is the main trouble here then... or is it not knowing or not feeling all of these bigger connctions?

since there is so much phyical and emotional lone and loneiness i can only inagine that people have lost the roots to this connection and so extremely that lonliness is a number one dis ease in many of the towns and cities that i have known.  even if you are right, how can this knowing (ops of forgetting) spread around the corners of this room, this street, this city, and the corners of this world?

my feeling is that this knowing in itself is not enough.

this thought has inpired me to look up with species of animal who live in packs and not alone, the list follows...


monkeys, most lemurs, apes (except orang-utans), wolves, dingoes, African wild dogs, dholes, bush dogs, lions, hyenas, elephants, most deer and antelope species, horses, dolphins, rats, buffalo, bison, ants, bees, termites, some wasps, banded mongooses, meerkats, dwarf mongooses, naked mole rats, and numerous species of bird and fish.  this list is not exhaustive ...

humans seem to be  somehwhere in between, pairing off rather than herding off as well as needing some time alone...

i have seen (and felt) that people stop growing their happiness levels when they are alone too much of the time, there is somethig about sharing time which is essential for most human being to reach their capasity for happiness (although hanging out with the wrong people can obviously work in the opposite way).

its more sunshinny today .)

clair

yes yes yes
but that is ok too
that is the main point
all embracing
the whole universe
is in such a precise and delicate balance
that the slightest change in regularities would cause it to collapse
making space for a whole new universe
that is physics
physics is Spiritual
no mistakes, yes to mistakes
yes to suffering, suffering is Love too
we are not disconnected but the feeling of disconnection
is part of the Love Play of creation
we experience a sense of disconnection
and that is part of the miracle
in devotional Love of God
the sense of separation is a Spiritual mood
an emotional flavor
Rumi cries about it often almost relentlessly
at the same time as he cries with the ecstasy of communion
there is a Spiritual mood for every known emotion
including loneliness
they are all to be cherished in relationship to God
to each other
to God in each other
i love the feeling of longing for my lover
feeling the absence of my Lover is Love
are you lonely?
am i?
do you Love loneliness?
the longing for God
is the evidence of God.... 
e

there is a beauty to longing because longing is romantic imagination at its fullest...its just sooooo full of imaginations and thoughts, full of stars and words...night falls at the moment we wish for it, day breaks in the moment we are ready, sun shines and when rain falls we are not alone.

c 

How could we ever be alone, at worst we are with our idea of ourselves, connected, disconnected, communion, separation, who chooses, Christians call it Grace, Bhaktas call it uncaused mercy, what does Rumi call it, did you know he never wrote a word, he had thousands of disciples and he just spewed this stuff out while one of them took notes, like Jesus, Buddha, Krsna, Rumi did not exist, he is simply one of Gods' ideas about us..... X

e

thinking about lonelyness makes me think about relationships and those of all animals.  the following animals are momogamous :

wolves, beavers, malagasy jumping rats, praifie vole, black vulture, bald eagles, dikdiks which is an african dwarf antelope


all but the antelope possess high demards of child care which gets split between male and female, so there is biological reasoning associated with their monogamy.  the male antelope leaves all child care to the female and so its reason for monogamy must reside in something other.

90 percent of birds are monogamous and that follows because they have to incubate the egg - a lot of work.  


since there are over 5000 species on earth there works out to be only about 3 percent of animals who are monogamous...do you think animals feel less jealouly than human animals? ... and maybe their next partner is just around the corner (as they not worried about whether he has long or short hair, he is creative/vegetarian or what his political beliefs might be)...?
c


The lovely thing about being an animal is that you don't need to worry because you haven't got the physical capacity to change much about your conditions, we can only speculate about the quality of their consciousness
The lovely thing about being a human is that the delusion of individual self and free will makes the story of our lives believable and therefore livable in the face of any experience....
e


the deeper the go the sometimes more beautiful.  the deeper you go the possibly more complex. the deeper go go the possibly less ignorant.  but is innocence is bliss?
c 

If by innocence you mean a mind in its pure and natural state, its original state that underlies all its psychological comings and goings I would say yes, innocence is bliss. X

e


horrah and yes indeed, thanks e

 .)

c